List of Alternate Monarchs and Aristocratic Lineage II

[Kellan Sullivan]

@Zygmunt Stary @isabella @Jan Olbracht :
With everything else had going as OTL, if Friedrich III of Saxony had married and left a son (born between 1500-1510), would the boy be a contender for the hand of either Anna of Hungary or Sigismund the Old's daughter, Hedwig? Or would him being the son of Luther's patron make the Poles think twice about such a match up*?

*was thinking his religious views are more like Isabella of Austria, Queen of Denmark and Emperor Ferdinand's than either his uncle (Johann the Steadfast) or Sigismund's brother-in-law (George the Beaded)

 

[Salma Amer]

Eleanor of Austria* (b.1481-.1512) m Frederick III, Elector of Saxony (b.1463-.1525)

Eleanor (b.1499-.) m Sigmund I, King of Poland and Grand Duke of Lithuania (b. 1467-.) as second wife with issues​

​

Frederick (b.1501-d.1510)​

​

Mary (b.1504-.) m William IV, Duke of Bavaria (b.1493-.) with issues​

​

Elizabeth (b.1506-.1515) ​

​

Ernest, Elector of Saxony (b. 1510-.) m Hedwig of Poland (b. 1513-.). with issues​

​

Anna (b.d. 1512)​

​

Fem Franz of Austria​

 

[eliamartin65]

Eleanor of Austria (b.1481-.1512)

Who's this?

 

[Salma Amer]

Who's this?

Fem Franz of Austria (b.1481-.)

 

[eliamartin65]

Fem Franz of Austria (b.1481-.)

Oh.

 

[Jan Olbracht]

@Zygmunt Stary @isabella @Jan Olbracht :
With everything else had going as OTL, if Friedrich III of Saxony had married and left a son (born between 1500-1510), would the boy be a contender for the hand of either Anna of Hungary or Sigismund the Old's daughter, Hedwig? Or would him being the son of Luther's patron make the Poles think twice about such a match up*?

*was thinking his religious views are more like Isabella of Austria, Queen of Denmark and Emperor Ferdinand's than either his uncle (Johann the Steadfast) or Sigismund's brother-in-law (George the Beaded)

If he is at least religiously flexible (like, say, Dukes of Cleves) rather than Lutheran zealot like John Steadfast then why not?

 

[Salma Amer]

Sigmund I, King of Poland (b. 1467-.)m a)Barbara Zápolya (b.1495-.1515) , b)Eleanor of Saxony (b.1499-.)

Hedwig (b.1513-.) m Ernest, Elector of Saxony (b. 1510-.)​

​

Eleanor (b. 1529-.) m ​

​

Frederick IV, Elector of Saxony (b. 1531-.)​

​

Hedwig (b.1535-.) m​

​

Mary (b.1538-.)​

​

Anna (b.1542-.)​

​

Anna (b.1515-.) m John, Margrave of Brandenburg-Küstrin (b.1513-.)​

​

Elizabeth (b.1535-.)​

​

john Sigmund ,Margrave of Brandenburg-Küstrin (b.1539-.)​

​

Anna (b.1544-.)​

​

​

Elizabeth (b.1518-.) m Francis II, King of France (b. 1518-.)​

​

Claude (b.1534-.) m​

​

Francis III, King of France (b. 1536-.) m ​

​

Elizabeth (b.1540-.)​

​

Charles Sigmund ,Duke of Berry (b.1544-.)​

​

Eleanor (b.1547-.)​

​

Anne (b.1550-.)​

​

​

​

Sigmond II, King of Poland (b. 1520-.) m Elizabeth of Austria (b.1526-.)​

​

Sigmund III, King of Poland (b. 1546-.) m Elizabeth of Austria (b.1554-.) with issues​

​

Hedwig (b.1548-.)​

​

Elizabeth (b.1551-.)​

​

Barbara (b. 1555-.)​

​

​

Sophia (b.1523-.) m Charles Victor ,Duke of Brunswick-Lüneburg (b.1523-.)​

​

 Charles-Sigmund, Duke of Brunswick-Lüneburg (b.1545-.)​

​

Elizabeth (b.1547-.)​

​

Anna (b.1551-.)​

​

Catherine (b.1552-.)​

​

​

​

Barbara (b.1526-.) m John Albert I , Duke of Mecklenburg (b.1525-.)​

​

John VII, Duke of Mecklenburg-Schwerin (b.1548-.)​

​

​

Eleanor (b.1552-.)​

​

​

Anna (b.1554-.)​

​

​

​

Eleanor (b. 1529-.) m Ferdinand Archduke of Tyrol (b. 1529-.)​

​

Ferdinand Archduke of Tyrol (b.1550-1601)​

​

Anna (b.1552-.)​

​

Eleanor (b.1556-.)​

​

Charles (b.1557-.)​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

 

[eliamartin65]

WI: Friedrich III, Holy Roman Emperor, marries Marguerite of Anjou (as he apparently wanted IOTL)
(@Kellan Sullivan @Nuraghe @isabella @Dragonboy @BoleynBuff)

Friedrich III, Holy Roman Emperor (b. 1415) m. 1450 Marguerite of Anjou (b. 1430) with issue:

1. Katharina (b. 1450) m. 1475 Georg, Duke of Bavaria-Landshut (b. 1455)
2. Anna (b. 1451) m. 1476 John Cicero, Elector of Brandenburg (b. 1455)
3. Helena (b. 1453)
4. Christoph (b. 1455 - d. 1463) - never married, died young
5. Elisabeth (b. 1457)
6. Maximilian I, Holy Roman Emperor (b. 1459) m. 1477 Emma, Duchess of Burgundy (b. 1459)
7. Kunigunde (b. 1460)
8. Rudolf (b. 1462)

 

[ordinarylittleme]

Secondly, how does she become queen if she's married to a Catholic?

She marries after taking the throne

 

[Kellan Sullivan]

She marries after taking the throne

She remained unmarried until her 50s? And everyone around her just allowed that when they were pulling their hair out that at age 27yo Juliana of the Netherlands wasn't married yet? The situations are not exactly the same, but the idea of them allowing the future queen to remain unwed is almost as ludicrous as her marrying a Catholic. Although, to be fair, if she and Luis WERE to marry and produce a child, while she would be knocked out of the succession, so long as the child was raised CoE, her child would succeed. Granted, I don't see anyone being entirely happy about this, but if Liz's child is wedded and bedded (potentially with a child or two of their own), it could work out

 

[ordinarylittleme]

She remained unmarried until her 50s? And everyone around her just allowed that when they were pulling their hair out that at age 27yo Juliana of the Netherlands wasn't married yet?

Yes, she had sisters while Juliana did not...

 

[LoyalHistoryBuff]

Yes, she had sisters while Juliana did not...

No sane woman in that time period would marry for the first time in their 50's. Either she would marry at a reasonable age and have children for the line of succession or not marry at all. There is absolutely no way anyone would allow a heiress to wait until her 50's before getting married, siblings or not! Also, I seriously doubt that COE would allow the match to happen, whatever she is monarch or not. That could cause a constitutional crisis worse than the one in OTL 1936. Pick someone else, non-Catholic, for her and have them get married at reasonable age please.

 

[Nova_Philomena]

Prompt: Henry I of Portugal (Cardinal-King) is successfully released from his ecclesiastical vows and aloud to remarry and manages to live longer.

Henry I of Portugal (b. 1512 d. 1589) m. Infanta Isabel Clara Eugenia of Spain (b. 1566 d. 1633)

1. Henry II of Portugal (b. 1583 d. 1615) m. Margaret of Austria (b. 1584 d. 1631)
2. Isabella of Portugal (b. 1584 d. 1638) m. Philip III of Spain (b. 1578 d. 1621)
3. Philip of Portugal, Duke of Viseu (b. 1586 d. 1637)
4. Catherine of Portugal (b. 1587 d. 1628) m. Victor Amadeus I, Duke of Savoy (b. 1587 d. 1637)

 

[Dragonboy]

Prompt: Henry I of Portugal (Cardinal-King) is successfully released from his ecclesiastical vows and aloud to remarry and manages to live longer.

Henry I of Portugal (b. 1512 d. 1589) m. Infanta Isabel Clara Eugenia of Spain (b. 1566 d. 1633)

1. Henry II of Portugal (b. 1583 d. 1615) m. Margaret of Austria (b. 1584 d. 1631)
2. Isabella of Portugal (b. 1584 d. 1638) m. Philip III of Spain (b. 1578 d. 1621)
3. Philip of Portugal, Duke of Viseu (b. 1586 d. 1637)
4. Catherine of Portugal (b. 1587 d. 1628) m. Victor Amadeus I, Duke of Savoy (b. 1587 d. 1637)

Good one! Idea: Napoleon's stepson Eugene gains the throne of sweden and norway as charles XIV

 

[Nova_Philomena]

Good one! Idea: Napoleon's stepson Eugene gains the throne of sweden and norway as charles XIV

Charles XIV Eugene (b. 1781 d. 1839) m. Princess Augusta of Prussia (b. 1780 d. 1841) [1]

1. Charles XVI of Norway-Sweden (b. 1807 d. 1853) m. Princess Marianne of the Netherlands (b. 1810 d. 1883)
2. Augusta of Sweden (b. 1808 d. 1810)
3. Marianne of Sweden (b. 1809 d. 1874) m. Frederick VII of Denmark (b. 1808 d. 1863)
4. Stillborn Twins (b. 1811 d. 1811)

 

[Dragonboy]

Charles XVI

XV

Good work overall.

Next one: Second french empire survives and Napoleon IV marries Beatrice, youngest child of queen victoria.

 

[Lalli]

XV

Good work overall.

Next one: Second french empire survives and Napoleon IV marries Beatrice, youngest child of queen victoria.

Really hard for British royal marry Catholic in 19th century. And IMO more plausible match is daughter of kaiser Franz Joseph I.

 

[Kellan Sullivan]

Charles XIV Eugene (b. 1781 d. 1839) m. Princess Augusta of Prussia (b. 1780 d. 1841) [1]

1. Charles XVI of Norway-Sweden (b. 1807 d. 1853) m. Princess Marianne of the Netherlands (b. 1810 d. 1883)
2. Augusta of Sweden (b. 1808 d. 1810)
3. Marianne of Sweden (b. 1809 d. 1874) m. Frederick VII of Denmark (b. 1808 d. 1863)
4. Stillborn Twins (b. 1811 d. 1811)

firstly, why would Eugène bother with adopting a name. Bernadotte adopted a new name because of the bad memories/associations of Johan II, Johan III, in Sweden. Eugen is an "odd" name, but has no bad connotations. After all, the Swedes accepted Oscar without too much fuss.

secondly, why does Eugène marry differently? The whole reason that Eugène was even considered in the first place was because of his wife being descended from the pre-Vasa kings of Sweden. So he marries differently- specifically to a power that Napoléon beat like a drum- and no offer. Either he and Auguste Amalie marry as OTL, or he doesn't become king of Sweden.

Next one: Second french empire survives and Napoleon IV marries Beatrice, youngest child of queen victoria.

Really hard for British royal marry Catholic in 19th century. And IMO more plausible match is daughter of kaiser Franz Joseph I.

the match is a popular myth based on the fact that Beatrice kept his picture on her desk. Victoria would've never agreed to it (firstly, she was against Beatrice marrying to start with it). Also, the actual match that was wanted by all parties involved was Napoléon IV to Maria del Pilar of Spain. Her death shortly after his was rumoured to be a suicide prompted by the loss.

No sane woman in that time period would marry for the first time in their 50's. Either she would marry at a reasonable age and have children for the line of succession or not marry at all. There is absolutely no way anyone would allow a heiress to wait until her 50's before getting married, siblings or not! Also, I seriously doubt that COE would allow the match to happen, whatever she is monarch or not. That could cause a constitutional crisis worse than the one in OTL 1936. Pick someone else, non-Catholic, for her and have them get married at reasonable age please.

agreed. Both of her sisters whom would've put England into very complicated personal unions

 

[Salma Amer]

Joanna of Aragon, Countess of Foix (b.1375-.1407) m Matthew, Count of Foix (b.1363-.1398.)

​

Jeanne, Countess of Foix , viscountess Castelbon (b.1398-.1430) m John IV, Count of Armagnac (b.1396-.1450) in 1414 with issues ​

​

John, Count of Foix, Count of Armagnac Viscount Castelbon (b.1418-.) m Leonor I of Navarra (b. 1426-.) with issues ​

​

​

Jeanne (b.1421-.) m Henry VI, King of England (b. 1421-.)​

​

Edward, Prince of Wales (b. 1440-.)​

​

Catherine (b.1442-.)​

​

Jon , Duke of Clarence (b.1444-.)​

​

Joan (b.1449-.)​

​

Mary (b.1452-.)​

​

​

​

Mary (b.1426-.) m John III, Duke of Alençon * (b. 1427-.) with issues​

​

John IV, Duke of Alençon (b.1450-.)​

​

Joan (b. 1452-.)​

​

Marie (b.1456-.)​

​

Isabella (b.1464-.)​

​

​

​

Martha (b.1431-.) nun​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

* Son of John II and Joan d'Orléans ​

​

​

 

[Zygmunt Stary]

@Zygmunt Stary @isabella @Jan Olbracht :
With everything else had going as OTL, if Friedrich III of Saxony had married and left a son (born between 1500-1510), would the boy be a contender for the hand of either Anna of Hungary or Sigismund the Old's daughter, Hedwig? Or would him being the son of Luther's patron make the Poles think twice about such a match up*?

*was thinking his religious views are more like Isabella of Austria, Queen of Denmark and Emperor Ferdinand's than either his uncle (Johann the Steadfast) or Sigismund's brother-in-law (George the Beaded)

If Sigismund saw advantage in that matchy, why not? It's not like Polish nobility was religiously zealot.